Episode 53: Mindset Of A Professional Builder With Clint Best

In episode 53 of the Professional Builders Secrets podcast, we’re joined by Clint Best, an Executive Business Coach with APB. Throughout this episode, Clint takes a deep dive into the mindsets of professional builders and how incorporating a growth mindset for yourself and your business can have profound benefits across the board.

 

Inside episode 53 you will discover

• The importance of mindset in a professional building company
• What the difference is between a growth and fixed mindset
• Why a growth mindset is key to running a successful business
• How to develop and incorporate a growth mindset into your building company; and yourself
• Why knowing who you want to become helps shape the trajectory of your business
• And much, much more.

Listen to the full episode to discover how a growth mindset can transform your business and free yourself from doubt and fear.

 

Clint Best - Executive Business Coach at APB

 

Clint was trained and certified by the world’s largest business coaching team and was eventually named the Canadian Coach of the Year in 2006, before leaving to form Kaizen Business Development in 2007. He has been successfully coaching business owners in Canada and the United States for 18 years and now forms part of the Executive Business Coaching Team at APB.

Connect with Clint

 

Timeline

0:39 How mindset impacts a professional building company 

3:03 The key mindset to unlock your businesses potential

15:25 Proven ways to conquer fear

23:06 Mindset habits for successful builders

34:53 How to become a realistic optimist

 

Links, Resources & More

APB Website

APB on Instagram

APB on Facebook

APB on YouTube

Join the Professional Builders Secrets Facebook group for builders & connect with professional builders world-wide.

Clint Best:

I think of mindset as the key to unlocking your potential. 

Clint Best:

You're not going to learn from your successes, but you're always going to be learning from your failures. 

Clint Best:

You don't need to be a mathematician or a scientist to understand the numbers in your business. 

Clint Best:

The mind is like a parachute. It works better when it's open. 

Clint Best:

Growth is about recognising the effort as opposed to the result. 

Clint Best:

Good is what keeps people away from getting great because they put a cap on things.

Bosco Anthony:

Hello and welcome to the Professional Builders Secrets podcast, a podcast by the Association of Professional Builders (APB) for building company owners, general managers, VPs and emerging leaders. Here we discuss all things running a professional building company from sales processes to financials, operations and marketing. We have another exciting episode from the Professional Builder Secrets podcast. I'm joined today by Clint Best, Executive Business Coach for APB. Clint, it’s lovely to have you back again. How have you been, man?

Clint Best:

Hey, Bosco. I've been fantastic.

Bosco Anthony:

That's great.

Clint Best:

Learning and growing all the time. Life is good.

Bosco Anthony:

Absolutely. Well, I'm really excited to be talking about the mindset of a professional builder today, and let's get cracking. My first question for you is how does mindset or a successful mindset impact a professional building company? And should builders care about having a positive mindset?

Clint Best:

That's a super easy one, of course, because how could it not impact them? I think of mindset as the key to unlocking your potential, having a healthy mindset or having the right mindset, and we'll get into that. But really, it's the key source of leverage in life and in business. I think about concepts like in The Law of the Lid [by John C Maxwell]. We have all these things that keep us where we are, or stuck, or limited. Mindset is really about how you're thinking about things; it's really about what's driving your thoughts, what's behind those things. When you work on your mindset, when you start to release and unlock your thinking, you start to release and unlock your potential. 

Bosco Anthony:

Can you categorise mindsets? What are the various types of mindsets that you could potentially have?

Clint Best:

There's a book called Mindset written by Carol Dweck, and it's been out for quite a few years. In there, she makes the case between a growth mindset and a fixed mindset. A lot of people will be familiar with that. They might not be familiar with her as the author. It's a great book; I highly recommend it. A simple way to think of it is open and closed. Growth is open, which leads to growth; fixed is closed, which keeps you stuck. I guess to drill down into that a little bit further, growth is about recognising the effort as opposed to the result. Most people with a fixed mindset might put a little too much weight on talent. They might think, “You're born with the talent you have, and those are the cards that you've been dealt, so stick with that.”

Clint Best:

It's very limited in that way, and it's subtle. We don't think we think that way, but if we really dial up our self-awareness, we can see where that might be getting in our way. So obviously, the growth mindset recognises that you can learn anything if you want to. I recently listened to Sky's podcast on skill building. The growth mindset is really connected to that idea of building skills, and “I can learn anything if I put in the effort.”

Bosco Anthony:

It's interesting; I find it really fascinating that the author you talked about, Carol Dweck, talks about fixed versus growth mindsets. I thought you were going to say positive and negative mindset, but then I just realised that's an emotion, that's not necessarily just a mindset. I thought it was really cool that you talked about looking at it from a constant state of being to a progressive state of being. 

Bosco Anthony:

I know APB advocates for playing to people's strengths. How does this fit into the concept of mindset through the coaching programs that you guys have and the mentoring programs? How do you bring this to the coaching and how do you get your builders to play to their strengths?

Clint Best:

Everybody has their strengths and weaknesses at any given point in time. Obviously, if a fixed mindset is about just doing what you're good at, what you're already talented at, and a growth mindset means that you can get better at things, when somebody decides to make improvements in their business, and they reach out to an organisation like ours to help them and help accelerate that effort, often they've got to earn the right, I guess you could say, or they’ve got to get there first. They might be a sole operator who still needs to juggle all the balls or work in all areas of the business. But the way that the growth mindset fits into that is when they start setting goals, start prioritising areas of the business. Of course, we help them with that. We help them do that strategically because you can't do everything at once.

Clint Best:

We help them with picking those spots that are going to help them based on where they are right now, and then prescribing the training and the learning that will help them to implement the structure into their business and help them develop themselves personally to overcome those things. So eventually, they can start delegating more things. 

Clint Best:

As they increase their profits and their resources and their ability to bring on more people or invest in more technology and continue to build their business, there’s a whole learning curve that comes with that. As they go, they can earn the right to play to their strengths. In other words, as they develop those things in their business, they put themselves in the position or create the circumstances for themselves to do the things they’re really good at and the things that they really enjoy. Does that make sense?

Bosco Anthony:

Yeah, absolutely. So, give me an example. What are the various examples, specifically for the builders out there and for our listeners who are builders as well, what is a classic example of a fixed mindset for a builder versus a classic example of a growth mindset for a professional builder? Let’s just say I’m a builder and I’m coming to you for coaching. What would be the different patterns between the two?

Clint Best:

You’re not always aware that you’re in a growth or a fixed mindset. It really comes out in your behaviour, as do most things. What I’ve found is that people who are in a fixed mindset struggle to get their homework done in between coaching sessions, so they’re in that victim area, making excuses or blaming it on something. Obviously, somebody who’s in a better place, in a fixed mindset, is eager to dig into that homework. They really enjoy it. They get on the call and they’re excited because they’ve learnt something. 

Bosco Anthony:

You mean the growth mindset would do that?

Clint Best:

Yeah, definitely.

Bosco Anthony:

Not the fixed, but the growth mindset would be that they’re eager to grow. Let’s use the WIPAA [Work in Progress Accounting Adjustment] as an example. They’d be all over it. They’ll be coming to you saying, “Hey, we’ve just done this. Take a look at it. Tell me what you think.” That’s the growth mindset, right?

Clint Best:

Yeah, exactly. They’ve put in the effort, they’ve pushed through whatever’s in their way or not in their way because they have a growth mindset, and they’re experiencing success, which of course motivates them to experience more success. So, in simple terms, that would be it, because people who are operating in a growth mindset are students. They’re learners. What’s the old story? “Learners are earners.”

Bosco Anthony:

This seems to be a really good pattern here, because what you’re saying is really, if you have a growth mindset, you’ll see it in the execution. The devil’s in the details of the execution, right? They’ll actually go above and beyond what’s expected, which is what you’re really coming at me with.

Clint Best:

Well, absolutely. Through encouragement, people can get out of the fixed mindset. That’s the key here. The key point is that it’s a choice. It really is a choice to stay there. And of course, one of the things that we do as coaches is to try to shed more light on the benefits of making a change.

Bosco Anthony:

Right. We’ll have to have another podcast episode for people who don’t do their homework and what Clint does to get them to do their homework. But that’s a whole different podcast. Look, I really find this topic really fascinating. I’ve done a TED Talk and it took me so much time to do; it was something that I had to really have a growth mindset for. I’ve lost a ton of weight. That was my personal story. I’m just curious, what’s your personal experience been on this whole mindset journey? If you look back now down memory lane, when did mindset really play a really big role in your life?

Clint Best:

Boy, that’s a great question. It makes me think of when I was growing up. When I was a kid, right from my early teens, I was always interested in personal development. I found it inspiring. I found it aspirational and uplifting. I just loved new ideas. I guess I’m a bit of an ideas guy. So that led to some reading and some learning. So, as I progressed in my career in the early days, I was dressed for success. It was something that I bought into, just learning and applying myself because a big part of being successful in business is that continuous learning and continuous improvement.

Clint Best:

I became a student of business as I got my first career job, and also became a student of building relationships with people and showing up, but not just showing up, showing up in an appropriate way, whether it be the way I was dressed or the way I behaved or the way I was groomed. That led to promotions and that led to a better lifestyle. That’s been my journey and what I’ve learnt in life is that when you stay open and you put yourself out there and you keep your mind open, the mind is like a parachute. It works better when it’s open. That leads to the aha moments, which leads to the breakthroughs, which leads to better results. So that’s been my experience. I’ve completely bought into the whole idea.

Bosco Anthony:

At APB, you have all the different business protocols or business units. We talk about sales, we talk about marketing. How does mindset apply for a builder within those business protocols?

Clint Best:

That’s the term that we use, business protocols, and we talk about them as they really are what most people think of as departments in a business: marketing, sales, operations or construction in this case, HR, finance and leadership. Leadership is the one that we believe lifts everything else up, so we call it the “plus one.” In all of those areas, for example with marketing, you think about limiting beliefs that hold us back, and everybody picks up some of those along the way. With marketing, for instance, someone with a fixed mindset might say, “All marketing is spam,” or “I’ve got to take the customers who are coming to me as opposed to the ones that I really want or would enjoy working with.” 

Clint Best:

One of the shifts that people make in their thinking as they learn, as they apply themselves and put in the effort and open themselves up to the possibility that there’s a different way or a better way, is that great marketing doesn’t feel like marketing. It’s helpful. It’s not spammy. You can get a better quality client and you can get more of them if you’re just more helpful. You can really engineer your marketing in that way. 

Clint Best:

In sales for example, one of the limiting beliefs people have is that salesmen are pushy, so they feel like when they’re selling, they’re being pushy. Really, the shift should be to presenting value and having a good process. When you do that, people start chasing you instead of you chasing them. Another example is in operations or in communications: someone with a closed mindset might think, “Nobody can do it better than me.” You start to learn about delegating and developing those skills.

Clint Best:

You can see how there are skills attached to each one of those disciplines. In HR, for example, you need to define your ideal employee, rather than just tolerating what you have. You need to raise the bar and understand that the ideal employee is out there, if you learn how to attract more of them and to be a better employer. I had a client recently here in Saskatchewan, whose name is Todd. He really bought into this idea, stepped out of his comfort zone and learnt how to do it differently. In a relatively small community, he attracted a couple of key people within a short period of time, which of course ended up giving him a lot of time back and just improved his mood and his confidence and everything else.

Bosco Anthony:

I’m wondering if this is the same Todd who was on our podcast a few episodes back, maybe?

Clint Best:

I think it was. Todd Lake. Yeah. Shout out to Todd.

Bosco Anthony:

That’s cool. What you’re telling me is, it sounds like there’s a glass ceiling that needs to be broken in order for the mindset to change as well, because you talked about certain trigger points, like the perception of marketing and sales. Let’s talk about pricing. Sometimes people need permission to succeed, to have the right pricing. Is it fair to say that builders need to break the glass ceiling to give themselves that permission to succeed?

Clint Best:

Oh, absolutely, because the glass ceiling is the limiting belief. But here’s the thing: those beliefs seem like the truth to us at the time that we’re holding them. We hold them very close and very tight and down deep, so it takes effort and openness. That’s how you break through those glass ceilings. I’ll be honest with you; I’m a coach, so obviously I advocate what we do, but the accountability is a big part of that because most people will give up. That’s really another one of those classic signs of a fixed mindset. In a fixed mindset, you give up. Really, a growth mindset is all about persevering and thinking, “I’ll figure out a way and I’ll make it work.”

Bosco Anthony:

Yeah. I’ve just figured out that you’re also probably not just a coach but a therapist as well, because you’re basically also getting builders to admit things and have a really honest conversation with themselves to apply and understand and then change those mindsets. It takes a lot to admit, “Hey, this is my limiting belief.” It takes a lot of openness and getting rid of the ego and the pride and the fears and admitting, “Hey, I’m struggling,” or “I need to do better in some areas.” So that takes a lot from a coaching perspective as well.

Clint Best:

Well, people are a big component of business. As a coach, you have to understand people and understand psychology and understand what gets in people’s way and be able to comfortably talk about those things. We don’t know what we don’t know. So how do you get around that? Well again, just opening yourself up to the possibilities and applying yourself and learning. It’s like when that aha moment comes for people, and they see that blind spot and they see it. It doesn’t often happen in the moment that you’re talking about it. It usually happens later on when they’re doing something else and their mind is relaxed, and something else happens and they connect the dots between this thing and that thing. 

Clint Best:

But you have to trust the process in order to put yourself in that position. I think of it as being like a gopher in a gopher hole; he thinks that’s the whole world. Then finally he has that aha moment, pops his head out, looks around and says, “Holy cow, there’s a whole other world of possibilities out here.”

Bosco Anthony:

Right, okay. Well, you talked about psychology as well. Society has a way of putting labels on things. People have a way of putting labels on things. They say that labels play a big role in mindset development as well. Can you give us some of your insights from the front lines and examples of clients who you’ve worked with, where you’ve had these areas where they’ve either been attached to a label, or they've had to crack the glass ceiling as well?

Clint Best:

Yeah. Labels really feed those beliefs we're talking about. Of course, you can have positive labels and you can have negative labels, you could have empowering labels and you can have disempowering labels. One of the labels that we come across a lot is, "I'm not a numbers guy,” or “I'm not good with numbers." Well, the reality is you don't need to be a mathematician or a scientist to understand the numbers in your business.

Clint Best:

The way that we break down that limiting belief is by simplifying it for our builders, and then through repetition and practice, helping them to understand that if they know the key numbers in their business and they're able to control those, it's an entirely different ballgame. Suddenly you can be very good with numbers, which doesn't mean, again, that's your favourite thing to do or that you're a mathematician. Labels are dangerous, and they're just something that we need to be aware of because people get attached to those things. I'm not a psychologist, but I know enough to know that when you let go of that attachment, things can change pretty quickly.

Bosco Anthony:

Right. From everything I know about APB, you're all about changing the professionalism within this industry. You're all about taking people to a new height that they haven't achieved before. When I speak to other builders, they always tell me how APB has helped them be on the business, not in the business, and they had to overcome some certain myths to get there. I'm just curious, what are some of the most common myths and obstacles that your clients must overcome to start to live that growth mindset?

Clint Best:

Well, the first thing they have to do is ask for help.

Bosco Anthony:

That's a hard one.

Clint Best:

It can be, because it, again, if you happen to be in that fixed mindset, then you probably don't want to know that you're there, so it's easier to stay stuck. They have to get over their fear of failure because in a fixed mindset, we tend to be afraid of failure and look at it as a negative thing. In a growth mindset, flip that around, and we look at failure as an opportunity to learn. You've probably heard old sayings like fail faster forward. You're not going to learn from your successes. You're always going to be learning from your failures. 

Clint Best:

People in a fixed mindset have to get over that tendency to be too cautious; they have to take a few more risks, but calculated risks. We talk about helping builders grow safely and securely. So, we are not about being careless or reckless. It's really about using proven systems. That's why we have confidence in saying, "Hey, don't worry, it's not going to hurt you. You're going to be fine. It won't hurt you or your business." If you have a fixed mindset you tend to be judgmental as opposed to being positive and encouraging with yourself or with others. One of the hallmarks of a fixed mindset is looking for approval, as opposed to really not caring what anybody else thinks, just feeling confident that you're doing what you need to do to get where you need to go. Does that make sense?

Bosco Anthony:

Yeah, absolutely. How does someone get started on working on their mindset? They've come to terms with things, they need help, they realise that, they acknowledge it. Now what happens?

Clint Best:

Again, start educating yourself. I think Carol Dweck's book, Mindset is a great book. I think you also mentioned one earlier. What was that?

Bosco Anthony:

It was called The Big Leap by Gay Hendricks. It completely blew my world. I think it was one of the catalysts for some of the changes in my life, both personally and professionally. It talks about being in the conscious zone of genius as opposed to doing things in the unconscious zone of genius. It sounds like Mindset's just a great book to read as well.

Clint Best:

Yeah. You start to do some research, start to learn. I think a big part of getting started is just setting some goals and setting some targets. One of the ways that you know you're in a growth mindset is that you start to hit your goals and you start to achieve your targets. Another way is just simply looking after yourself: self-care, exercise, making sure you're getting enough sleep, making sure your diet is working for you because those things affect your mood. They affect your ability to learn, to take in, to retain information, to be open, to be creative, to make a plan and stick with it.

Clint Best:

What that does is it forces that perseverance because you're not overthinking things, you're not letting your feelings direct your actions – because we don't always feel like doing what we need to do to move ourselves forward. But here's the thing, and you might think of feelings or motivation; what comes first, motivation or action? A lot of people think you need to get motivated to take action, but often you need to take action to get motivated because you start to get that movement and momentum. Get started on something, make a plan, stick to it and of course get yourself a coach.

Bosco Anthony:

I think they call it activation energy too, which then leads to the motivation as well. We've talked about the hallmarks of what a fixed mindset would look like, and you pointed out a really good one, which was looking for validation from others. Let's look at the other side of the spectrum. Let's talk about the growth mindset. What are some of the successful habits of high-performing building companies that you work with today that you've already transformed from a fixed mindset through to a growth mindset? What are some of the trends you're seeing in the market and what do those behavioural habits look like?

Clint Best:

The behavioural habits would be all of those important but not urgent things that we think about when we think about the Eisenhower grid, for instance. Things like planning, developing people and not doing everything yourself. So that would go to training, really, dialling up your belief in good training and investing in those things. Again, on the personal side, exercise and reading. On the relationship side, hanging out with maybe a higher quality of people sometimes. As much as that sounds bad, really a lot of people stay stuck that way. I think those are some of the key behaviours that show up. I think that doing more problem solving is a behaviour. In other words, not just accepting things but challenging things. “We can do better. What's a better way?” That sort of thing. Does that make sense?

Bosco Anthony:

Yeah. It sounds like the human character traits also blend in with the business character traits, from what you're telling me. When someone's going through a growth mindset, there's a blend of both, it sounds like, from what you're getting at.

Clint Best:

Oh yeah, absolutely. The two are tied pretty closely together.

Bosco Anthony:

What are some of the tips on developing a growth mindset that can impact a building company positively? What do you encourage when you take on a new builder? What are some of those tips that you want them to take on so that they can start seeing the successes? Let's say you're working with a new building company. You're trying to encourage them to move towards a growth mindset. What would those early initial coaching calls look like to get them to that area that you want them to be operating out of?

Clint Best:

First of all, we do provide training on mindset just to start opening up their awareness on that. Some are heavily into personal development, and then there's a whole spectrum of people. But first of all, the accountability and calling people out, and asking them the challenging questions, and asking them a lot of open-ended questions to get them thinking and then allowing for that awkward pause while they are thinking and not letting them off the hook. Accountability is a big tool that we use, and it shows up in those ways. Providing a safe environment is another really important part of working with anyone. Creating the conditions where people feel like they can be vulnerable and open up and let go of those things or start that process. I think those would be big ones.

Bosco Anthony:

Okay. What are some key benefits that come with developing a growth mindset for builders? Where does the benefit show up in the business, typically?

Clint Best:

Well, the big benefit of course is just the return on investment financially. That's always going to be there. But I think other benefits are on a personal level, just feeling fulfilled or filled full, as they say, and just having that level of satisfaction in what you're doing. That transfers onto the team, so it’s really just the process of learning and growing, Bosco. You become a student of life. Once you've had a taste of it, you’re hooked.

Bosco Anthony:

It's addicting.

Clint Best:

It is addicting, and in a very good way.

Bosco Anthony:

From a coaching perspective, how do you measure a success mindset? Are there any metrics where a positive growth mindset could show up? Let's use the building side of things. What metrics do you look at when you're working with your clients to know that they're in a growth mindset?

Clint Best:

That's easy because we have a whole set of KPIs, or key performance indicators, to track them. Whether those be on their P&L [profit and loss statement] or in their sales process and their marketing process at the team level, when those start to go in the right direction and those targets are hit, they’re indicators of a growth mindset. It doesn't always happen quickly; sometimes it takes effort to move them, so patience and persistence are key. But I think the metrics are in the business. They’re your leads, your conversion rates in your sales, the quality of your leads, the number of leads that you're getting and of course your margins; it's going to show up there. 

Clint Best:

Then of course on the personal level, you're going to feel less overwhelmed. You're going to get more done in less time because you're becoming more efficient, et cetera. Your team's probably going to grow. Are those the kind of metrics you're asking about?

Bosco Anthony:

Yeah. I'm just curious because obviously you're dealing with mindset often on the coaching calls. I'm just curious how you keep the builders accountable? It sounds like you guys have systems in place to know how that accountability measures up as well.

Clint Best:

Sorry, Bosco, I just have to reassert that those targets are not going to be met typically if the builder has a fixed mindset. It's just because they're not going to do the work. It's really difficult to coach somebody who stays in that fixed mindset. They really have to come out of it.

Bosco Anthony:

Fair enough. I think I know the answer to this, but I'm going to ask it because I've always thought about this as well. Is there a destination for a successful or growth mindset, or is it a continuous, constant work in progress? I'm always thinking about this at the back of my mind. Is there a place of nirvana that says, "Hey, you've arrived," or is that something that continuously changes over time?

Clint Best:

Well, I'm sure you do know the answer to this, and the answer is, of course, it's unlimited. Possibilities and potential are unlimited. It'll be different for everyone because everybody has their own version of nirvana. But the reality is, how ‘good to great’ is a perfect example of that. Good is what keeps people away from getting great because they put a cap on things. 

Clint Best:

At the same time, I think what people realise is that there's such a sense of empowerment that comes from being and staying in a growth mindset, and at different points you will shift to different areas of your life, from your business goals to your relationship goals, to your health goals, to maybe your spiritual goals or any of those things. I'm not advocating by any means that being successful in a building company is all about being rich and famous or those sorts of things. It's really about being happy and fulfilled and feeling like your life is balanced and you're enjoying it.

Bosco Anthony:

Fair enough. Look, I could talk to you for hours on mindset, but I'm conscious of our time together today. But I'm going to end with one really important question, and I guess it's a future perspective but a current perspective as well. We're living in a world right now with so many uncertainties and challenges and pressures for building companies as well. Builders are feeling it, and they've been feeling it for a few years now. 

Bosco Anthony:

But how do we hold ourselves accountable as business owners, as builders, as professionals? How do we hold ourselves accountable to ensure that we maintain ourselves and not let the challenges and pressures of this world get in the way of what we're trying to achieve? I'm sure it comes across your calls with your clients as well, where they talk to you about some of the current challenges or the uncertainties as well. How do you help them or empower them to stay true to where they want to go?

Clint Best:

One of the ways that we do that is we keep it real. One of the quickest ways to fail and to make bad decisions is to operate from a place of fear, for obvious reasons. I like to think of it as staying realistically optimistic, being a realistic optimist. Because the reality, Bosco, in terms of trends, is we've been living in a hyper-heated economy for a number of years now. We're simply, in a lot of ways, just course correcting right now. It's been particularly unhealthy in the building world because when there's the kind of demand that's been placed on the building industry, and then with the upset in supply chains and those kind of things to exasperate that overheated industry, really, even though people have been busy, nobody's really winning.

Clint Best:

I think as things cool down, this is where mindset will be so important because those builders who have been working on themselves and on their businesses and quietly putting the right things in place will still be there when the dust settles. We fervently believe that. I think there's a lot of healthy things that are going to happen. Again, in a positively, realistically optimistic mindset, we're going to see the demands on employees start to improve, and the demands on materials and supplies. All of those things are going to lead, I think, to a better outcome for both the customer and the builder. 

Clint Best:

But again, a growth mindset leads to a resilience and a flexibility that can't be achieved with a fixed mindset. So as things change, we need to change along with them, and we have to be following what's going on and interpreting those in an empowering, positive way, not walking around with rose-coloured glasses, but really making well-educated, well-timed decisions. Those are the guys who are going to win.

Bosco Anthony:

Any final words for our listeners out there around mindset? Any words of wisdom from you before we wrap it up?

Clint Best:

I think I've said it all so far. I would just encourage anybody who is not happy with where they're at right now to really take a hard look in the mirror and say, "How am I getting in my own way and how can I make some improvements to that?"

Bosco Anthony:

I think someone wise said once to me, "Know who you're becoming," and that changes the entire conversation.

Clint Best:

Absolutely.

Bosco Anthony:

I think that really resonates with me too. Well, Clint, it was a pleasure talking to you again. It's been a while. But I'd love to have you back again in the future. I always appreciate the stimulation that you bring on these interviews, and I wish you well in your future goals as well.

Clint Best:

Thank you, Bosco. It's been an absolute pleasure. So right back at you. I hope life treats you well till we see each other again.

Bosco Anthony:

Thanks for joining us today, mate.

Clint Best:

Thanks, Bosco.

Bosco Anthony:

Thank you for listening. Remember to subscribe to Professional Builders Secrets on your favourite podcast platform and leave a review. To learn more about how the systems at APB can help you grow your building company, visit associationofprofessionalbuilders.com. See you next time.